I decided to write an article identifying and singing the praises of the ten best survival rifles to own.
And that’s what the title says at the top of this article.
That being said, listing the 10 “best survival rifles” requires real compromises.
It’s a cold hard fact that a single perfect survival rifle doesn’t exist.
There are too many unique survival scenarios to consider.
Plus, owning ten survival rifles won’t do you much good, unless you have a very large family or a caddy to carry all your guns.
So I decided to fight conventional wisdom and focus primarily on the top five (or what I consider the best of each survival category) and then give you five runner-ups.
But again, let me be crystal clear.
One weapon can’t do it all and ten options leave a lot of room for less than stellar performance in various roles.
It’s sort of like expecting a dump truck to accelerate from zero to 60 MPH in 4 seconds.
In the right application, a dump truck is extremely useful, just not when acceleration is the goal.
The bottom line is survival situations vary, as well as the tasks required of your survival firearms.
So what are the roles we expect our survival rifles to play?
I like to break down the main survival tasks into 5 broad categories:
- Hunting Small game
- Hunting Large game
- Perimeter-defense beyond 200 yards
- Self-defense inside 200 yards
- Self-defense in close quarters
So let’s take a look at each task and the best survival rifles to accomplish them.
Hunting Small Game
In an actual wilderness survival situation, you may need to live off the land, and that means we can’t overlook small game.
There are a lot more squirrel, rabbit, possum, and other varmints around than there are deer. Dropping a ten-point buck might feed the family for weeks, but those will be few and far between if times get tough.
Squirrels, on the other hand, are rats with cute tails, and we have no rat population problems. Dropping three or four squirrels (or rabbits) every few days can get your family by in a pinch.
But in the small game arena, there are many excellent rifles, each firing a variety of respectable calibers.
You could look at the .17 HMR cartridge, a very flat shooting, very high velocity round, and realize it’s the be-all and end-all of the varmint rounds.
You may also become intrigued by the .22 Magnum for its power over the standard .22LR. This cartridge is fired by great rifles and is excellent as long as you can run down to Academy Sports or Wal-Mart and buy another box of shells.
When the big box stores run dry, these more exotic calibers will be useless unless you’ve got a large stockpile of ammo storage. But wait, you say. These cartridges are available at the local big-box store, and the .22 LR is always sold out. And you’re right – however, let’s look at the reasons why.
Reason 1 – The .22 LR is never in stock because people recognize this cartridge as the most versatile, desirable, and affordable survival round. People hoard them by the thousands when they do become available.
Reason 2 – It’s the only cartridge I know where you can walk around with a thousand rounds in your pocket – or a lifetime supply in your backpack. They don’t weigh much.
So it’s a well-established fact that the .22 LR makes the grade for best survival small game caliber. So let’s choose our small game survival rifle to match the best survival ammo. And there’s only one choice:
1. The Scoped Ruger 10/22 Take-down
(check out today’s price)
To be honest, I personally own a Remington 597 with a good scope and love it. However, having taken it down for gun cleaning and discovering all the small and seemingly fragile internal parts, I have to say the Ruger seems like a more durable design in the long run – and that is what the Ruger has been in for decades – the long run.
Ruger and Remington are competitors in the semi-automatic .22LR regime, however, over the years the public has voted with their pocketbooks and the Ruger comes out on top.
Plus, the newer take-down versions break down into component pieces. So you can easily store it in a survival backpack to be reassembled later as the situation requires.
Perfect for those whose survival plan includes bugging out.
Hunting Large Game
So your family is sick of squirrel and rabbit stew, and suddenly that ten-point buck presents itself at 300 yards. Which rifle do you wish you had in your hands in that situation?
Well, you need a cartridge that can reach out and stay lethal at 300 yards or more. You also need to kill that deer with one shot. You don’t need to wound him and then lose him.
Remember, he’s got a 300-yard head start, and he’s a deer—which means he’s fast, even when injured.
If you get off a bad shot and hit him in the left front leg, you want the leg blown clean off. That should slow him down somewhat. So we’re not talking about mid-sized cartridges, like a 125 grain 5.56 or 7.62 x 39mm traveling at 2100-2400 FPS.
Instead, we’re talking something in the 170-220 grain region in .30 caliber soft-point or better traveling 2700-3000 FPS. We’re talking .30-06, .308 Winchester, or .300 Win Mag.
(If you find yourself flush with surplus Soviet ammo, the 7.62X54R is also an excellent choice – though now we’re talking surplus military hardware and surplus military rifles. That’s a topic for a future article.)
So what is the best rifle for delivery of this type of bullet? Call me a traditionalist, but the US Army and US Marine Corps are pretty good references.
2. Remington 700
(check out today’s prices)
The Remington 700, in various forms, has been the mainstay of the bolt-action sniper world for decades. When the Army began sniper school during the Viet Nam War, it had no weapons designed for the role, so they pulled scoped Remington 700s (and Winchester Model 70s) from the shelves of local sporting goods stores for use in combat.
Decades later, the Remington 700 in military trim is still a frontline bolt action sniper rifle. A high-quality scope is a must in order to build your ultimate sniper rifle.
Perimeter Defense
Let’s face it; perimeter defense means keeping the bad guys away from your people by killing them at long range.
Maybe effective signage will keep them away or perhaps you’d prefer the incoming rounds be a complete surprise. That’s your personal moral choice. However, you do want whatever lead you send their way to have the proper impact in the desired location.
That means you need accuracy and lethality.
So why not pick the Remington 700? Surely, if your survival rifle can take down a deer at 400 yards, it can take down a man at 400 yards. No doubt. However, the benefit of the bolt action on accuracy is also a liability when it comes to quick follow up shots or multiple moving targets.
The deer might stand there wondering what the kicked up dirt next to it means and wait there for a second follow up shot, but humans will realize immediately what’s happening.
So a semi-automatic option is your best choice when hunting the “most dangerous game”; Man.
3. AR-15
(check out today’s price)
When we’re talking semi-auto, lethal, and accurate at these ranges, we’re talking a scoped AR-15 in 5.56 NATO – or maybe a scoped AR-10 in .308 NATO. The AR-10 has the better knockdown power, however, the recoil of the 5.56 mm round fired from an AR-15 with a quality buffer is negligible, so your aim is less affected.
The AR-10 has the better knockdown power, however, the recoil of the 5.56 mm round fired from an AR-15 with a quality buffer is negligible, so your aim is less affected.
Your shots should come fast, with easy acquisition of your second, third, and fourth targets. Quality AR-15s are cheaper than the AR-10 and so is the 5.56 mm round.
You can carry quite a few rounds on your person as opposed to the .308, .30-06, or the like, and they are readily available and affordable – at least before the excrement hits the fan.
So stock up.
Self-defense Inside 200 Yards
Let’s say you don’t have the advantage of a wide field of fire. You live in the dense forests of Georgia, not the plains of Kansas. In this case, perimeter defense might shrink to an uncomfortably close distance of fewer than 100 yards.
In close quarters, you need a weapon that is both accurate and reliable.
Now we’re not talking 400 yards accurate. We’re talking guaranteed lethal hits on man-sized targets at less than 100 yards. There is one other significant problem at this distance – you can expect the bad guys to shoot back.
So every round you fire must count, and the weapon cannot jam. An AR-15 stovepiping a spent round at 400 yards takes just a moment to clear – a moment you might not have at 50 yards. So what do I recommend?
4. AK-47
(check out today’s price)
There is only one choice – the favorite weapon of every despot, dictator, and communist in the world –the AK-47.
Now, to be fair, I’m not talking about a real AK-47. You can’t just pick up a full-auto AK-47 on Gunbroker. I’m talking an “Americanized”, semi-automatic AK-47 variant.
Realistically, the full auto function of the original is relatively useless, unless you are fighting in a small room or spraying and praying to provide covering fire for someone else. Accuracy goes out the window in full auto.
Oh, you’ll kill that guy at 100 yards, might even hit him two or three times, but you’ll also empty your magazine in 3 seconds, spraying the surrounding trees with the rest of your precious 7.62x39mm rounds.
The AK design is tough and designed for the mechanical torture of full-auto operation. In semi-auto operation, everything is simple, over-engineered, and reliable.
I’ve owned a cheap Romanian AK variant for four years, have fired thousands of rounds through it, only clean it every five or six times I go to the range and have never experienced a jam.
The 7.62×39 mm round is lethal and even cheaper than the 5.56 mm. Inside 200 yards the AK has adequate accuracy. 
However, the one concession I would make is to add a holographic sight – even a cheap one enhances the shooting experience.
I have a little $30 unit on my AK and, although the open sights are fine, I love having the fine cross-hairs to lay across the target.
Most AKs come with side rail scope mounts. At one point I had a 9-power scope on my AK, but I had mixed results.
The side rail mount of the large, somewhat heavy scope, along with the significant slamming of the mass of the gas piston and bolt within the rifle, prevented the scope from holding a reliable zero.
The small holographic sight offers no magnification, but it is so light on the rail that holds up better to all the steel being thrown around inside the old Soviet design. It holds a pretty decent zero and my follow-up shots are right where they are supposed to be.
With the 30 round magazine as standard, you may want to invest in some of these gems – and keep them loaded and ready in your gun safe.
Another option is the large 75 round drum magazines available for the AK. However, these don’t hold any attraction for me. They just look heavy, and attached to an already heavy AK – makes the weapon freakin’ heavy.
Plus, with 75 rounds at your fingertips, the temptation to spray and pray, rather than carefully aim, may cause you to waste a ton of ammo unintentionally.
So in summary, quoting Samuel L Jackson from the movie Jackie Brown, “AK-47. When you absolutely, positively have to kill every MF in the room”.
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Self-Defense In Close Quarters
Let’s say you not only live in a heavily forested area with no long line of sight, but you also fell asleep on your watch, and the bad guy is now inside your perimeter or even inside your house.
At this point in a perfect world, you could choose to engage the bad guy with a handgun – but the word handgun does not appear in the title of this article. So let’s assume you are grabbing for something larger. So what would you prefer?
When you’re startled close-quarters combat, you naturally begin to spray and pray. If you have the AR-15 or AK-47 variant, you can make a lot of noise and poke a lot of holes in your walls, possibly killing your family members in the next room, however, if you want to remove doubt at close quarters – use a shotgun.
5. Mossberg 500
(check out today’s price)
A tactical, pump 12 gauge, such as the Mossberg 500, takes spraying and praying to a whole new level. You fire a couple of salvos of this bad boy down a hallway; you are going to hit your target – multiple times.
Regular, long hunting shotguns are at a disadvantage in these conditions since they are not as conducive to mobility in an enclosed area. The little street-sweeper holds this nickname for a reason. Go tactical.
So the next question now becomes – shot or slug?
Double aught buckshot increases your likelihood of a hit, but a slug delivers an exceptionally deadly blow at close quarters. Here are the two big differences.
A shot pattern does not guarantee involuntary incapacitation. Now if the intruder gets hit with shot in a vital area (without wearing a plate carrier), then the matter of his withdrawal doesn’t matter. He’s going down.
However, he can be hit several times, even mortally, and still decide to scram on his own volition or he may decide to fight back for his few remaining minutes in this life.
You’d prefer him to be unable to make this choice since it could turn out bad for you. If on the other hand he’s hit with a 12 gauge slug – he’s not going to be able to make this decision.
Any head or torso shot with a slug is going to blow a significant hole in him, and all the walk is going to go out of his feet. Even if he is hit in a leg or arm – he’s still in little position to fight back.
It’s likely his arm will be blown clean off (though it could hang on by a few tendons) and, although it’s less likely to blow off a leg, it’s more likely he’ll bleed out fast with the largest artery in the body running through that part of the anatomy.
Regardless, the shock of his injuries will prevent his choice to continue the fight. Slugs deliver devastating blows. However, they also defeat the purpose of the shotgun – the large pattern of projectiles that virtually guarantee a hit. You can miss with a slug.
So it’s your choice. Or do you have to compromise at all? There are self-dense shotgun shells that incorporate a slug along with buckshot.
My shotgun of choice? The Mossberg 500 in its many variants in 12 gauge, which also happens to be the shotgun of choice for the US Army.
So here’s a quick recap of my 5 top survival rifle choices:
- 1 – Ruger 10/22
- 2 – Remington 700
- 3 – AR-15 (reputable brands include: CMMG, Inc., Bushmaster, Sig Sauer, Ruger, Colt, Daniel Defense)
- 4 – AK-47 (semi-auto variants-Krebs, Mossberg, CAI, Kalashnikov, Saiga, etc.)
- 5 – Mossberg 500 Tactical Pump Shotgun
My Vote For All-Around Best Survival Rifle
So if I could only take one, what do I consider the best all-around survival rifle?
I’m going to go out on a limb here and not choose a .22 LR rifle. I do think there may be a better choice – or at least a marginally better choice.
Do you want range? Reliability? Lethality? Readily available ammo? Do you want the best survival rifle that can do it all?
Well, that weapon does not exist – HOWEVER – I do have a good candidate:
- 6 – Ruger Mini-14 (check out today’s price)
This little jewel is a compact carbine, packs a 5.56 mm punch, is semi-automatic, reliable, durable, and optics ready. If I could only take one rifle with me—and a few hundred rounds of ammo – it would be this one.
Runner Up Best Survival Rifles
So how about some runner’s up? Here are some other best survival rifles to consider:
- 7 – Remington 597, Marlin Model 60 (in .22LR)
- 8 – Winchester Model 70, Savage XP Trophy Hunter (in .30-06, .308 Win, .300)
- 9 – Sig Sauer M400 SRP (in 5.56mm), Ruger Mini-30 (in 7.62X39mm)
- 10 – Winchester SXP Defender Shotgun (in 12 Gauge)
That puts me at this article’s goal of the 10 Best Survival Rifles.
Prepare, Adapt and Overcome,
“Just In Case” Jack
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Arthur Raynolds says
A couple comments. First, this rectangle along the left edge for the social medias options is at the least annoying and withholds a full viewing of videos, and hides the first of several letters of words along the left column. I am using a laptop. The desktop is in the shop getting a new case to filter the air.
Second item refering the survival rifles, you mention the 10/22 Ruger rifle. What is you opinion ion the new charger pistol model? I have one with a green laser for short range of around 25 yards or so. Perhaps more when I tighten in the laser beam. I’m pleased to learn I loaded my 20ga Mossberg logicly with both shot & slugs..
Thank you for providing this information.
Just In Case Jack says
Thanks for letting me know about our Social Share buttons blocking content. I’ve made a couple of adjustments to our site code and I tested in on the devices/browser’s I have available. I hoping the problem has been fixed. I’d love you know if it fixed the problem for you as well??
I think the Ruger Charger looks like a really cool little survival pistol/rifle. It fills the gap nicely between pistol and rifle and with a laser ought to be pretty accurate. Like most things Ruger—it also looks to be high quality.
Great little weapon for hunting or self-defense and one you can stick in a backpack or strap across your back with ease.
For a survival, prepper gun I think I’d go with this over the 10/22 takedown.
Jack
Joe says
My only comment is to ditch the AK-47 as it’s redundant given the AR-15 that’s already on the list. You say the AK is for close in (200 yds or less) but the AR shines from close in up to 400 yds so there’s no need to have an AK. For close in and under 100 yds you say you “need something both accurate and reliable” but the AR is more accurate than the AK and I have never had a malfunction in my AR so again the AK is not needed. You also say the AK is lethal but so is the AR. Hit anyone anywhere with an AR round and most anybody I know is out of the action. I have seen the AK placed on other peoples SHTF list but the AR is more versatile.
Rob says
I have both AR, and AK, with several thousand rounds each, my AK is tough and in many situations a tougher weapon is helpful, if you drop it in muddy water it’s still going to eat! I have a 30/06 Winchester model 70 with a good scope a colt 22 and a 12 gauge semi auto beretta and my S&W 9mm with 16 rounds so I may get killed but not without a fight!
Chase says
InRangeTV AR15 mud test
vs
InRangeTV AK47 mud test
I’m pretty sure the AR15 does okay on reliability. Great article otherwise!
Crusher says
My top shelf AR can’t even reliably fire lacquered ammo. It gets hot, melts and gums up the action. turns an semi auto into a single shot real quick. In a shft situation I want something that can shoot ever I can get my hands on. When was the last time you even heard of a 400 meter fire fight ? Under what conditions would you ever have 400 meter line of sight in a shtf situation? AK all day.
Ronin says
Afghanistan is one.
AR’s and M16’s don’t need or use lacquered as good brass can be found for the weapon.
The 5.56 kills by velocity and at 1 to 200 meters it’s almost the king. Does not deal with barricades well but is accurate enough to overcome that issue.
Too each his own.
I won’t feel underguned with either.
Rod Donovan says
I think my SKS is great for short and semi-long shots.You can dress it any way you want with third party folding stocks, replaceable magazines, to even a drum. It also shoots better than an AR. A simple thump, thump. Instead of boing, boing…..Rounds are inexpensive and are to be found everywhere. Its reliability is well known, and with a spike in the front, you can stick someone to the wall before pressing the trigger and blowing a hole in him. Not a problem hitting a frying pan at 200 yards with open sites. You can also walk your shots. Yep, I’ll keep my SKS as my main battle rifle…..
Greg says
Replying to Ronin,your response is apples/oranges,if the grid goes down I’m not going to have the backing of the United States,military and their logistics.So the response to getting ammo,is totally off base,this isn’t the Army/Marine Corps,fighting in Afghanistan,it’s most likely(in my case)and many others,suburbia USA.No where to go to more ammunition.
Alan says
1. High power rifles are great until you get older or start having shoulder issues. Then it sits in the gun safe.
2. AR. Hope you have the ammo cause every time there is a gun scare it’s gone online. Try buying any quality ammo next time there’s a quarantine scare.
3. 12 gauge…. same thing. Works great. Wait till your older and have shoulder issues. Then go shoot some slugs.
4. The best gun? What ever deer gun you have and lots of ammo. A good hand gun and a lot of friends You trust with guns. Alone you ain’t gonna make it.
You can stock up now. But look 10-20 years down the road. You honestly gonna be able to shoot an Uber magnum? Run up and down hills? Plan now before you end up with crap you can’t use.
Steve says
My 5 choices are:
Ruger 10/22 breakdown with threaded barrel suppressed.
Remington 870 12 Gauge with slug barrel and PDX Defender’s.
AR-15 any reputable brand.
AK-47 any reputable brand.
Ruger Scout .308
Runner Up: I agree with the Mini-14 5.56
Bill Randall says
a shotgun, with just a bead sight, is pretty worthless vs a rifleman using cover at a mere 40m. nobody practices enough to be any good with $1 a shot slugs, so realistically, the shotgun is limited to buckshot range, which aint waf. A Silenced M4, with scope, in a see thru mount, with luminmoust iron sights, and a Ciener .22lr unit, that’s what you want. It’s the most versatile one gun and you can only carry one longarm.
Michael says
@ Bill Randal Yeah, no. I shoot slugs at 100 yards easy in my Rem870.
Flatheadfletch says
Sorry to disagree but my survival rifle would be a savage over n under combo in 223 n 12 gauge . If I could have what I wanted. It would be 17 HMR over 20 gauge !!!
AKBAL says
I enjoy, cause I discovered exactly what I used to be having a look for. You’ve ended my four day lengthy hunt! God Bless you man. Have a nice day. Bye
Justin says
Desert Tech MARc suppressed shooting 300blk… with a few interchangeable barrels for other round-types picked up along the way or for specific target types. ..a grenade launcher and/or shotgun attachment for the more stubborn targets.
It’s not the gun that kills but the bullet. .22LR Barnes Varmint Grenades.
Light. Powerful. Accurate. Extremely deadly.
jim says
Very good article. My one comment though is that I would collapse the perimeter defense and HD within 200 yds into one category and one weapon. For these you recommend the AR15 and AK47 respectively but both weapons are similar enough that the AR15 (which more people are probably going to have) does both functions well. A scoped AR15 is great from very close yardage out to several hundred yards so I would therefore combine these two categories into one and therefore recommend the AR15 for this one category. But look on the bright side: it now allows you another pick to round out the top 10 list.
Bill Randall says
there’s no need of anything more than the silenced, shorty AR, the Ciener .22lr conversion unit, 60 gr Nosler Partition softpoint 223’s and 60 gr Aquila subsonic .22’s. You can brain moose and elk to 100m with it, snipe efficetively to 1/4 mile and if you hold the bolt shut, the 22 is BB gun quiet. Noise will get you killed, and it scaares off game. Crap happens at night, too. the silencer gets rid of the muzzleflash and if you aint got luminous sights, your rile is worthless half of the time.
Patrick P. says
Best versatile weapon I own.
Mind you I took mine on active duty in Afghanistan on a dumb dare. ONLY after I proved reliability to myself to bet my life on it or not. Means 1,000 round drills.. Sadly my assigned AR actually had more failure to extract, stovepiping, FTF…
Despite my butt getting into Major Major Trouble…
I Took a Hi-Point 45 acp carbine on active combat duty in Afghanistan.
Don’t go diva on me. I was able to trade “stuff” to acquire a mil issue reflex scope and midrange scope with VERY expensive quick change.
It performed AWESOME at takedowns, sniper at 350 yards or less. one round seemed to always knockdown n end that person’s fight.
Breaching was fun shooting from the hip was easy.
Bill says
You’re joking right…?
glenn says
Marlin 30 30.
Vincent Sherrill says
Weatherby Vanguard Series 2 Rifle 30-06 Springfield
Great rifle and ammo is plentiful
Antique Jarhead says
Good for Glenn! you might own 15 firearms, but you can only handle two or so at a time. I’d choose a .357/.38 lever action, mainly because of the versatility and because I’m too old and beat up to handle a .30/.30, and if I’m gonna die by some bad guy’s gun, well, it is what it is…
paddy says
good choice, also your side arm can match this caliber, always a good solution to a big problem, ammo mix up…
voice of reason says
best all around survival rifle would be a Remington or Winchester semiauto 1950-60’s vintage, with the optional aftermarket 10 shot clip. it is basically an assault rifle with a more powerful cartridge, a modern Garand. it can be scoped easily and is very accurate. also it’s very light. model 740/742 for Remington, forgot the Winchester model number. very overlooked and currently dirt cheap under $400 quite commonly.
Bob says
I would definitely say a M&P15 over a bushmaster anyday.
GW Trasky says
If you must have an AR15 get a piston gun & short load your mags.
Guns and Butter says
I’d have to disagree with the piston. Although your action will be cleaner, it’s just another failure point. Direct gas impingement is how the rifle was designed to operate.
Carlos Figueiredo says
This might surprise everyone,
While serving in Africa, I had with me a 0.308 Winchester 88, For ammunition it used 180 and 200 grain bullets, depending on the game.
That rifle was light enough to allow for a quick swing/aim with great accuracy and power. Indeed, it brought down every food game available, including water buffalo.
In all it proved to be 100% reliable and accurate under all weather and terrain conditions.
I would like to get another, but Winchester stopped manufacturing them and those in the used market are just too expensive.
Andrew says
Lots of “issues” here.
There isn’t much of any reason to choose a semi auto .22lr rifle for the purposes of small game hunting. A manual action, bolt or lever, is just fine. The Ruger 10-22 is one of the least accurate .22 rifles out there in stock form, and accuracy is a really big deal in a small game rifle as you have a small bullet on small targets with small vital areas. A Marlin Model 60 is a much better choice for a semi auto, however a more appropriate choice would be a bolt action such as a Savage.
I’m going to assume from your comments on hunting deer that you have never actually been hunting. Even if you were to hit a deer in the upper leg and “blow his leg off”, if you hit a deer anywhere but a vital area, you will never see it again. Even if you took off running after you broke the shot, by the time you got to the 300yard place that you shot him, that deer would be in the next county by now. Sometimes deer will run 2-300 yards after taking a heart and double lung shot purely from the adrenaline dump. When you shoot they bolt 95%of the time.
The area you live in also dictates the kind of large game hunting rifle that suits you and your area best. Out west or in the open plains, a bolt action shooting a high velocity round is best. But in wooded areas like the southeastern US, your longest shot will likely be inside of 100 yards, maybe stretching out to 200 on rare occasion. This scenario calls for a lever action(.30/30) or intermediate caliber rifle(AR15 or AK47), not only for efficiency but it needs to be short and light for ease of handling in the dense wooded areas.
Your recommendation for an AK inside of 200 yards is short sighted or uninformed at best. The choice between an AR or AK inside of 200 is merely a personal decision and what platform you train around. It’s been proven that the 5.56 round is equal to or more lethal than the 7.62×39 for a given loading. Using properly assembled rifle with quality parts, the AR is no less reliable than an AK. Several torture tests have proven this under far worse conditions than would ever occur in the US. The AR is also vastly more ergonomic for most people and easier to run fast.
Using cheap optics is doing nothing but setting yourself up for failure, they will fail at the most inoportune time and leave you with a rifle you can’t aim with until you remove the optic unless you co witnessed your iron sights.
Magazines, clips are for Garands, magazines feed rifles. There is a difference.
Your recommendation for a shotgun for home defense is also out of line. A pump action shotguns takes A LOT of training to run efficiently. They are an effective tool to have in the toolbox, but actually quite limited in their application. Spend some time shooting one and you will soon learn. CQB/home defense distances, your shot grouping with any type of shot will be the size of your fist or smaller. Depending on the load you choose, a 2 3/4″ 00 buck load is very similar to firing off 8-9 rounds of 9mm all at once in the size of a fist. It is still very easy to miss even at CQB distance with a shotgun. A slug really only grants you a bit more knockdown power and infinetely more penetration. Both 00 buck and slugs are a reckless and very poor choice if there are others in the home to be worried about over penetration with. Best choice is either a handgun (not what this article is about) or a 5.56 rifle firing 55gr expanding ammunition. Even 00buck will penetrate 4+ interior walls where as the 5.56 will tumble and fail to penetrate walls if you miss, yet if you hit your target, it dumps all its energy in the target for faster incapacitation. Not to mention semi auto for faster follow up shots.
Shotguns do not in any way virtually guarantee a hit, no way. Far far from it.
The US Army does not use the Mossberg 500. They issue the Mossberg 590, which is quite rarely used, and when it is, it’s one man in a team uses it for door breaching, it’s typically not used on living targets. The 590 is different from the 500 mostly on the quality of parts used.
A shotgun will absolutely not blow off an appendage. Nothing short of a .50BMG will do that.
Your one rifle choice of a Ruger Mini 14, is horrible. It is quite possibly the most inaccurate 5.56 rifle ever produced. At 100 yards it has groups larger than a shotgun at that range. Usually in the 10-12 inch range. That’s around 10x the size it should be.
Best one rifle would be the AR15. It can do everything you could ask except long range large game hunting. 5.56 handles home defense and battle uses. .22lr conversion for small game. .300blk for suppressed or large game at intermediate ranges. 6.8 is also useful on large game out to 300 yards or so. .458socom or .50beowulf are heavy hitters inside 150yards. 6.5 Grendel will reach out to 1000yards with proper skill level for up to 200lb animal/person.
Hoesa says
You said “…….the 5.56 will tumble and fail to penetrate walls if you miss,….”. Don’t think so……… A projectile traveling at about Mach 2 doesn’t “fail to penetrate”, especially if it’s drywall.
Mike says
Actually it does fail to penetrate which is why LE has given up on the 9mm submachine gun for entry teams….less over-penetration and litigation. It’s not about the bullet’s speed, it’s about the ballistic coefficient, design and weight.
Joe says
Ignorant response. A 223 or 5.56 projectile travels at ballpark Mach 3-3.5 and weigh 55-77 grains. It WILL go through several layers of drywall.
Ken says
Sorry you go it wrong. Watch the videos 9mm bullets going through more Sheetrock pieces than the 5.56. Years and years ago when I was a young swat officer I’d didn’t believe it either made a bet list a case of beer. Again look up the videos
Joe says
Let’s get this straight. You’re saying a 5.56 and or 224 traveling at upwards of 4000 fps will not penetrate several layers of drywall? Is that correct?
Cernunnos says
Actually why most moved back to rifle calibers was because they realized carrying a pistol caliber carbine was as effective as…..their pistols. If they are going to carry a long gun, why not have the benefit of a rifle caliber? In the 2010, 11, 12, 13 and 2014 UCR from the FBI there were ZERO injuries from over-penetration in law enforcement operations. But from projectiles fired that missed their target – that is a different story and why shot placement trumps all other factors. 5.56 NATO with 55gr from a 16″ will be about 3100 FPS at the muzzle – you are over by almost 1000 FPS.
So when that armed intruder steps behind the sheet-rock wall, you want to be sure that wall is concealment, not cover. YOUR family – having been properly trained and drilled, will be on the floor and covering their doors with their own weapons and should not be in the line of fire. If you are going to defend your location with firearms,and have not trained AND DRILLED extensively for these scenarios with professionals or knowledgeable trusted friends , shame on you.
james says
wow….you’re a special one….the AK is a lot more reliable than the ar15. less moving parts means, longer life and less issues.
Joe says
Why own two guns when the AR is the better overall one capable of much longer take down distance and just as good at close in???
Rick says
There’s always one isn’t there?! “Lots of issues here” is right.
every deer will bolt to the next county, never see it again blah, blah, blah… looks like you don’t hunt much either. how does anyone ever come home with a deer, especially bow hunters…
the 10/22 is quite accurate for small game, that has been proven over the last 40 years and it’s reliability speaks for itself.
mini-14s are plenty accurate (and extremely reliable) your ignorance is astounding. most minis and all of the newer production, in the last 15 years will give you 1″ – 2″ moa at 100 yards. 3 moa is acceptable battle accuracy
223/5.56 rounds will most definitely over penetrate (as will buck and slugs). there is this thing called the internet, lots of useful, educational, factual videos on it. you should check it out sometime.
pump shotguns are not difficult to run and are extremely versatile. if one prefers/needs they can use 20 ga instead of 12 for lighter recoil and faster follow up shots.
there is very little difference between the 500 and the 590 – we’re not going off to war – you could also try a remington 870
personally i prefer a 45 carbine for home defense.
internet commandos will likely be the first to die in a shtf event and probably by “friendly” fire
Bill Randall says
you’re quite ignorant. Nothing about shtf is going to be peaceful. Millions of people will be perfectly willing to shoot you on sight and it only takes ONE
Crusher says
Haha funny guy . So a 556 round can’t penetrate drywall? I am going to make sheet rock ballistic vests.
Alan says
Don’t know what kind of mini14 you have but I don’t recognize anything your taking about in the one I own. Mine does 2-3 inch groups at a hundred yards with military ball ammo all day long.
Molaki says
PUMA lever action .357/.38
Taurus 9-shot revolver rifle in .22lr/.22wmr
Savage lever action .22wmr
Marlin Glenfield Model 60 .22lr semi-automatic
Hi-point 9mm carbine
I can shoot little critters, big critters (such as deer or pig) and of course those pesky 2 legged critters.
mike cascioli says
Good survival tips ! ! !
samuel lewis says
Ar-15 is best all around option in my opinion. Throw is a cmmg to .22 conversion kit and now you have a gun that shoots 5.56 .223 and .22 with a sombre bcg change that takes less than 30 seconds. You then have a defence rifle a big game rifle and a small game rifle. And since the .22 can be easily silenced with something as simple as a plastic bottle you won’t be giving away your position.
Robert says
Good article. I have the Mossberg 500, the 10/22, and a Henry Big Boy .357 lever action, which covers ALL the bases here in this article… All dialed in, oiled up, and thoroughly practiced up on! But I am about to get the Ruger AR 556, JUST to make sure I am covered, all around.
James says
I use both ak and are also fnfal 308 histandard bullpu every other round altered n moss burg 500 same way ruger 1022 for quite hunting
Sky Soldier says
My alternative and better than the Ruger 10/22 is the Browning SA .22LR takedown. And for distance and knockdown power my choice is a Seekins Performance .308 with Vortex scope. Of course close quarters remains Mossberg 500 chambered with a mix of shot shells: 00, slug and rabbit shot. Never far from my grasp are: Walther P99QA .40 cal SA and Ruger GP100 .357 magnum hand guns.
L.A.West says
Gonna wait a while before I make any moves. Let’s see if TRUMP holds true to his words. He said he would make sure the 2nd Amendment was reinforced so that no politician or party could overrule or put restrictions on it – forever. I also read he wants to loosen up CCW permits so that anyone who passes the background check would be able carry open or concealed anywhere. Time will tell – and we’ll see which rat bastard politicians try to stop him. They may stay quiet until after the Elections for the House. Right now, American’s are pissed off, and won’t take any more bull-crap from Washington D.C, the Leftist’s, or the UN about their gun rights. Had Clinton stole the Election – it would be chaos right now in the gun stores!!!
Knuckledragger says
This wasn’t approached from a practical logistic stand point. By far, the most predominant rifle in the U.S. is the AR series in a lot of different configurations but the most prevalent caliber is 5.56mm with .223 Remington coming in a close second. No, I am not dismissing the .22LR. With a standard AR-15 lower and a couple of choice uppers, you can use the same magazines and rifle to fire 5.56mm and .300BLK. As another poster pointed out, with a .22LR conversion kit and a couple of .22LR magazines adapted for use in an AR lower, you solve the issue of carrying an additional rifle. If you decide to go the AR route, then make sure you pick up a rifle with a barrel chambered for 5.56mm as it can fire both .223 Rem and 5.56mm without issue, the same can not be said for the reverse.
A .22LR in a survival situation is failure waiting to happen and only because of the ammo. As a person moves around, sometimes in rough conditions and with changes in the weather, the bullet in a .22LR cartridge will become loose and allow moisture to seep in to the casing, neutralizing the powder and ignition charge. The bullet is also lead, which can corrode over time, also leading to issues with firing. Ideally you would want to store the ammo until needed but in a SHTF situation, the first rule of survival is to be mobile, often in a moments notice.
The AK-47 is fine for combat but it has its issues, the most glaring is that with all the different countries making them, the specs are across the board. This includes American manufacturers of the rifle, there is no definitive standard for parts and ammo. If I recall, the Soviet rifle bores were at .308 while the Chinese bored theirs at .311. Pin placement and part dimensions also vary. 7.62x39mm isn’t exactly easy to find here in the U.S. either and not all AK magazines will work in any given AK type weapon.
I love the 1911 and the .45ACP but for practicality, my SHTF sidearm is the Glock 17 in 9mm. You can go anywhere in the world and find a part for the G17 and install it yourself without fitting. To show off this neat feature when the Glock was becoming popular, the manufacturer had a press day and completely disassembled 100 Glocks, down to the pins and rails, mixed it all up in a bag, reassembled them with what came out the bad and all of them fired with no issue. My 1911 will require fitting of parts for tools I may not have the room to carry. Also, the 9mm is the most popular handgun round in the U.S., so that’s a no brainer.
This is pretty much the case for the AR-15 Mil Spec. Most every part will fit in to another rifle if it is mil-spec. Mil-Spec isn’t some Holy Grail, it just means that the parts and rifle fall with in a given set of tolerances to satisfactorily operate. The AR will work as a good, decent CQB weapon without shattering your ear drums (AK series) and is good for perimeter defense out to 500 meters if you know what you’re doing. Go with the Direct Impingement model over the piston, there is no real advantage of the piston over DI and the DI is more readily available. Gas piston manufacturers have their own standard to the piston setup.
As far as the vet poster who claimed to have a Hi Point carbine in the ‘stan, my question is, why aren’t you and your Chain of Command in jail? Only a handful of units were allowed to carry their personal weapons and I know people in those units personally. The only reason they would carry a Hi Point was to use it to prop open a door.
Just my two cents from 20+ years of observations and training.
Just In Case Jack says
Thanks for your input. I always appreciate knowledgeable, well thought out debate.
Poprlj says
Not disagreeing but for shotguns the 97 , was /is with out peer at bad breath range ,also prefer the 1911 in 45 ACP,,Semper Fi
enzo says
Good article, and I am REALLY surprised to have all of these bases covered and not a long gun extra, with the exception of my Remington 12ga.1100 magnum. Might just get a barrel and a tactical stock instead of getting the mossberg 500?
Small game: Ruger 10/22, check! Laminated stock, burris 2-7x wide field scope. Check
Big game: Sako .Hunter .270. Leupold Gold Ring scope. Got it years ago. Looked at the Remi 700, but the guys whose hunting prowess I respected suggested the Sako. Checkaroo
Perimeter defense:: Ruger Mini-14 paratroop with Burris 5×36 prism scope and reflex piggyback. Tac light and laser. Check on the Perimeter, Check on the Best Overall.
Inside 200 yards: Oh yes. Spikes Tactical 300 BLK SBR with LRS (long, extra quiet) suppressor. 4×32 ACOG and RMR piggyback. I live in heavy woods. I want super light, very quiet and drop it in the mud, hide in the lake, throw it in the truck toughness.
For CQB, I am very proficient with my handguns. HK’s all, The VP9 has green laser, the USP 40 has tac and green laser. Several P7’s are great for conceal and most people don’t know how to use them if you lost them. The mini with paratroop stock gets SHORT for interior maneuvering.
The Mrs. is very good with here PPK/S too. Not a high energy gun, but it should hold her inside safely.
I thiink I’m set! WOULD kinda like that Mossberg though.. 🙂
Sideliner 1950 says
For a 22 LR, also consider the Henry AR7 Survival Rifle. “Takedown” so it easily fits in the pack, semi-auto, under 4 lbs. Sweet.
Duck of Death says
Im surprised the Norinco SKS didnt get a mention. Its a very reliable rifle that doesnt require constant care. It spits out whatever you load it with. One can pick up 1000 rounds of cheap Tul ammo for a hair under or over 300 dollars. Yes. It will spit those out flawlessly as well. The hooded site is a nice feature as well. New shooters can do well with it. Its also available at a decent price, usually under 300 dollars. If youre on a budget and want a very reliable rifle, cheap effective ammo, decent range, then the Norinco SKS is the way to go. A thousand dollars should get you the rifle, a thousand rounds, two 30 round magazines, and a 75 round drum and bipod (for defensive fixed positions).
Thats just my opinion, of course.
With the pap pistol, now i only have to invest in 7.62 x 39 ammunition for my rifle and pistol. I will admit that the pap is a bit more particular about its ammo, but im hoping it just needs broken a bit more.
Sam says
I am a fan of the SKS myself , I have owned 3 AK’s that the best I could do is about 4″ at 100 a mini that was very accurate until barrel got hot .
At least 6 SKS’a – I always seem to go back the an sks even for deer hunting.
The sks’a all would shoot less than 3 and the one I have now soots less than 2″ and I would shoot pop cans at 200 meters so I know I can stretch that a bit- I also like that I don’t have to worry about magazine loss or failure
I”m set up to carry 4 guns- which is more weight than I like but as long as you can stay hidden and out of trouble doable– but 2 are Pistols so kinda moot point to the article here.
I have an old savage 22/20ga pack gun as one- my sks – an xd9 with 2- 20 rounders and 3 15s plus my old 22/22mag H&R revolver- I have been hunting shooting and carrying for 45 years and carried pistols and shotguns for duty for over 25 years
Non of these may be the best– but they work for me and all of them together cost less than $600 at the time they were bought..
Andy Reynolds says
In my mind, a good 38/357 lever action carbine would fill a few different rolls in a survival situation. Light loaded 38s will take small game, 158gr or 180gr 357 will take deer size game and two legged varmints. Perimeter defense from 100 yds to inside the perimeter, and is short enough for close quarter defense. Coupled with a good 308 bolt action and you’ve got everything covered.
Patrick says
I think most of this depends on what you have at hand and/or train with. Everyone has their preferences and opinions on whats best. I just wish someone can define “knockdown” power! I hate this term more than when I hear the media describe a near plane crash as a near miss.. What the fu$&! is a near miss? Whatever projectile that comes out of your weapon has to actually hit something vital or significant to even have your so called knockdown power. I hear so many macho, low self esteemed guys that have the biggest and badest socom this and this 50 cal twin turbo rocket blaster that… Damn, a freaking rock can have significant “knockdown” power if you hit the right spot. Take whatever you have and train with it and train again and again. And just always be prepared and have a backup plan or two…
Superbomb says
While I enjoy the intent of the article and conversation after, I have to disagree with much of what’s being said. First, I have to be that annoying guy who points out that realistically “the gun you have in your hand” is the best one for survival. That said, in a true survival scenario reliability and ammo that can be carried or shared are the main factors. For deterrence of lesser dedicated 2 and 4 legged predators the sound of any firearm can be effective and when properly asserted even a small round can kill a man or drop reasonably sized game. For those reasons alone the .22 caliber rifle or even long barreled pistol would suffice. And while I’d choose a ruger 10/22 for its quality, reliability and customization potential most made by savage, marlin, etc are close to as good. I find the added cost and potential negative aspects of accuracy and immediate readiness for the breakdown rifles of any kind to be make them unwanted for me. And while you can’t really reload 22s the fact you can carry 1000s of rounds easily makes it a hands down favorite. In a true EOTW scenario 22s could also be used for barter without hurting too much. Rounding out my list would be a Ruger SP101 .357 for close quarter / concealed. A quality revolver is more accurate and reliable than any auto and the 357 has plenty of power and most importantly can share 38 rounds as well. Also easier for ladies and kids to use. The SP101 is over built and heavy yet compact. A simple pump shotgun is a must but with a medium length barrel. Too long and it’s cumbersome but with a full stock makes a great club. You can still hunt with it. Too short and all its good for is making noise and covering the same territory as the revolver. And nothing ends a fight faster than the sound of racking a shell into the chamber. Last, if you really had to have an “assault” weapon there’s really 3 choices in my mind for the average person of average means. A tried and true surplus AK47 for its reliability and cheap ammo, perhaps an MP5 (I know it’s really a sub) because it fires the ever present and available 9mm round as most auto pistol owners have an abundance of and was proven highly effected by spec ops when used with silencers as lightweight and accurate, or….I guess….the AR15/M4. A word about the AR15: I know this has become the pride of most gun people who fancy themselves as “operators” but I carried a variation of this gun in the infantry and I hated the thing. With all the handles, mags, etc sticking out it catches on everything in the bush and it’s miserable trying to drop into the prone from a dead run. It’s accurate and easy but it’s NOT a single shot killing round at 5.56 it’s a maiming round that takes up nearly as much space and cost as one that does kill. Furthermore, they sell lower cost versions without a forward assist. Unless your at the range or planning a war inside a carpeted building that’s like driving a car with electrical issues. Even the tiniest grain of sand in the action and you have to bang on the assist to chamber the round. I’ve never understood the love for this weapon? I’d take a UMP or HK93 or SG556 over it any day of the week. Last but not least, while most would put it in the “tool” category I’d add the great need for a good fighting knife. It’s silent, deadly, nearly breakdown proof and can perform several other tasks including splitting kindling or taking down a small tree, making a spear or bow. That’s it, my 2 cents. Thanks and good day to everyone.
Bill Randall says
you’re spreading lies. one grain of sand wont stop an AR and enough sand will stop even a bolt action. We pick the AR cause it’s the most versatile gun out there. If your survival rifle can’t fire the .22r and the GI rifle rd, you soon wont have any ammo for it. then its worth nothing.
Dbl Tapr says
Keep in mind if the SHTF for real. Ammo will be hard to acquire. Your weapons better run anything NATO as it is the most produced world wide. If you are truly concerned stay stock up. A minimum of 1000 rounds of each caliber needed. I suggest 9mm. 223/556, 308, and 12 gauge as these are easy to purchase in the USA. Most importantly due your research. If you are new to firearms get some instruction. Never forget to Practice, Practice. Practice.
Steve says
Thanks for the article and all of the replies. My wife and I had a. 40 cal and 9mm handguns already, and we just bought a Kel Tec KSG and AR15. Not a bad start overall for civilian rookies. I plan on using Aguila mini shells in the KSG, 00 Buck and slugs. With a capacity of 24+1, that is 13 rounds, flip a switch and 12 more before a reload. The AR is for longer range targets and has almost 0 recoil. The KSG I believe will work well interior and out to about 20 yards with 00 buck, longer with slugs. I just hope I can find ice for my shoulder when it’s her watch. We went to the range today. I am actually considering a Taurus Judge if my accuracy with the handguns doesn’t improve with practice, and it can fire both .45 cal bullets and 410 shotgun shells.
Walt Stutler says
I like the AR for my bugout weapon, plenty of parts 7 ammo out there and once you build them you know how to keep them running. But for my EDC bag I have a 17HMR little Badger with 4X scope. Tiny, ammo is light weight and that round is deadly with well placed shots! Please do not think this is just a varmint round.
Joe says
My choices
1. Ruger 10/22
2. Remington 12 Marine Magnum
3.. Saiga 308 modified like Arsenal to handle different capacity magazines
4. Winchester 70 extreme weather 308
5. Glock 45cal high capacity
6. Walters 9mm PPS M2- conceal carry
7. Wheel gun S&W 7 shot 357
8. Remington 870 for hunting combo barrels
9. Saiga AK47 modified like Arsenal to handle different capacity magazines
10. Wheel gun S&W – conceal carry
Daniel says
Everyone forget about the mini thirty
Isaac says
I have had the privilege of firing a few hundred different weapons. Both foreign and domestic. I won’t share what my job is. And though this topic is much like talking politics, you have to remember the point. Each person has their own focus, desire, and level of training. Some have thousands of hours and military budgets to fund their practice sessions, some have just a few dollars to their name, some people are stacked like Hull Kulgan (probably spelled wrong and don’t care), some are built like and may even be dainty teenagers.
Here is what is important; very few firearms company’s make horrible weapons, most fire every time you pull the trigger. Size and fit is most important, if it’s not comfortable or your afraid of it, you likely won’t put the time In to become proficient. One of the people I trainedand and introduced to firearms was afraid of guns. Wouldn’t even touch em. So I started her with airport. She had so much fun that by our second outing she was firing my National Match M1A. (. 308). when she started looking for a carry pistol about month later, I helped her choose a Rugger 22lr revolver. Why? She wasn’t afraid to shoot it, she could afford it, and she liked it so much she took it to the range 3 times a week. She became very proficient. A few on target 22lr rounds are better than any single 45 off target. You can’t miss enough times to win a war right? I personally carry a Sig P228 9mm. Why, it’s a perfect fit and I can hit anything moving out to 60 yards (not an exaggeration). Though that is not my first choice that far out.
The AR argument is a strong one and here is why; it’s lite, cheap, easy to use and modify, parts are available everywhere (even Walmart.lol), ammunition is abundant, and they’re easy to train on. For the SHTF scenario, this is the weapon that you will be able to find parts and ammo to keep yours going. In the U. S., 1 in 3 people have an AR varient, you will be able to get what you need even if stores are out.
Personally, I don’t like the battery of arms.
My go to is a Sig 556 {sorry, sig stole my heart) so the AR is not for me but that doesn’t make you wrong If you think it’s the best thing since sliced bread.
POINT: If it fits, you can afford it, and you’ll spend time to become proficiant with it, it’s for you.
Also, keep in mind that most people with information on this topic, have fires just a hand full of different firearms and are mostly going off of Internet study.
Different round sizes are for different jobs, bit for the average civilian, you will likely only ever need 2 guns, and more than likely fire less than 200 rounds per year (on average). You will want a pistol for home defense and carry. And you will want a low caliber (likely 556/223) for home defense and ranged defense. Having one weapon that can accomplish multiple tasks, or a couple weapons that can accomplish many are your cheapest and most beneficial options. 9mm is easy to handle, has great penetration and stopping power, and less deflection through glass and other media that 45. This is why it is the first choice for FBI, HLS, and now the majority of Municipal Police departments around the nation. 223 is the most versatile round being that it is the cheaper variant to NATO 556. Yes, 223/556 does tumble, but that will never matter to (again) most civilians. 556 was originally designed and accepted by NATO as a “wounding round”. It was actually designed to be lite, cheap, and wound the enemy more that kill them. The idea was that a dead enemy takes out 1 enemy, but it takes 2 enemy to remove a wounded one, which occupies 3 enemy, thus making it easier to overwhelm enemy numbers to obtain an objective. Just so happens that any bullet placed in the correct area will kill an enemy. The 556 was actually so ineffective against armor that the 300 Blackout round was designed. Less range, bigger punch (kinda like 45acp to 9mm). Once again, most civilians will never see, notice, or hopefully ever need the difference in performance.
Stay classy, have fun, and enjoy what you’ve got.
Bill Sykes says
HK417 7.62 sniper variant – good for everything including long range big game.
Robert says
Unless something major has changed with the Ruger mini 14 I would rather have a slingshot. First shot from a cold barrel deadly accurate. 3 or more shots in a couple of minutes on a rest with scope could not hold on target. Neither could anyone else that tried rapid fire. Sold mine
Gemeniguy says
You plan on carrying a bench in your back pocket and a scope on your rifle when someone is shooting at you at close range with iron sights? Good luck trying to pick someone up with a scope at close range who isn’t standing still like a stationary target. With a 0.2 inch aperture ghost ring sighted MINI-14 I can put 5 rapid fire rounds in an 8 inch pie plate at 30 yards from the standing position. If I need to do more than that, I’m out of there. In fact, if I do it right and with a little luck I won’t be firing a single round at anyone and no one will be firing a single round at me. As Wyatt said, the best way to win a gunfight is to not show up (or something like that).
StevefromtheSouth says
5 rounds rapd fire into an 8 inch our plate at thirty yards? With a rifle? Heck son, I would hope the majority of “survivors” could handle that task with a pistol and save that ‘spensive rifle ammo for longer shots where it’s needed…
Gemeniguy says
With the decision made not to use a scope, longer shots are a moot point for me. At age 71, my eyesight limits 8 inch pie plate accuracy to about 30 yards. This doesn’t mean I still cannot lay down shots beyond 30 yards. I just can’t count on them being accurate. Again moot point for me. Unless I’m cornered, it’s going to be shoot and scoot. Lay down a few shots in the direction of fire and exit the location. I don’t even want to take a lucky shot from a single shot .22 unless I have an absolute reason to stay there. .223 ammunition is not exactly expensive for me. I do not have to fire hundreds of rounds a week to maintain accuracy. I can do it with 30 rounds or less. I used to hunt whitetail with some of the older hillbillies up here. These guys might fire 20 practice rounds a week before season and they are crack shots on whitetail. Presumably, when they were young they had to learn to shoot with a limited number of rounds because they couldn’t afford more. A few other things you can do. Learn to shoot from the standing position. If time affords, get in a kneeling position. If the opportunity presents itself, use the edge of a tree as a rest. I’ve shot whitetail from all three of these positions. You can also practice without even firing a shot. I used to do this for about five minutes or so a day about a month before opening day. I would raise my rifle slowly like you would do on a whitetail. Then imagine a whitetail in the distance. I would then pull the rifle stock as hard as I could against my shoulder and count to 30. It’s an isometric exercise and helps you to remain rock solid on a target. You can also practice leading a moving target. Track the moving target and then swing your sight in front of the target and touch off when it comes into view. I did own an AR-15 at one time and it was a fine rifle. But it’s accuracy beyond that of a MINI-14 doesn’t apply to me. For my own unique reasons, I prefer the MINI-14 over an AR-15. I know what my limitations are and work within those limitations. I live in the Northern Adirondacks on the edge of the middle of nowhere. The most likely scenario for a confrontation is going to be around thirty rounds or less because you can’t see beyond that in the woods. Anything you are going to do is going to be a compromise because you can’t cover every scenario. I just go with the most likely scenario. What I’ve said here is just a fraction of what I say about survival up here. But I can’t write a book on it.
Lhstr says
Browing tear down .22, 5.56 mini and a/r 5.56 glock 26 and 17. water jug and haul ass. Of course the misses has the mini.
Greg Adkins says
Obviously the big question is what do we classify as SHTF,to me it’s an EMP.No WROL.So(in my opinion)Hunkering down is most important,so it’s 12-gauge first,handgun,second.then a semi auto rifle of military caliber.I’m in an urban area,so a hunting rifle,even a 22 Will not be needed(shotgun)will suffice for small game if needed.If forced to flee(obviously)shotgun will be left behind.
NVR says
Read all the comments and now my 2 cents.
I have my favorites in order of distance of shot:
1.Tikka .308 with Burris scope
2. Sig AR15 (NATO) with ACOG
3. Mossberg 500 12ga Tactical with red dot/light forward grip.
4. Springfield XDm 9mm.
My only other comment is to these men who constantly speak about giving their wife or girlfriend some small hand gun because of recoil or blah blah blah.
I taught my daughter ,at 12 years old, to shoot with the same firearms that I use. She is now 15 years old and handles all weapons like a pro. If survival is at stake my little girl is capable of using any firearm to take out the threat to herself , the family or friends with any caliber.
I don’t want her facing a big threat with a little gun …that’s just stupid.
The only difference we have in firearms is
her favorite hand gun is her CZ SP-01 9mm.
lhstr says
1.) .22lr 10/22, 2.) Break bbl .22 air gun w/extr. pts.(very quite, 3.) 9mm Glock, millions made. With Trunk gun Kel-Tec S2000 using Glock 9mm mags; 4.).223/5.56 AR/15, 5.) Mossberg.223 and .308 Scoped They use military mags; 8)12 ga. flex w/2 barrels.(hunt and defense) The reason for air rifle it hunts quietly, in a pinch can hunt man, but really ammo forever no primers, bullets or gunpowder req’d. All weapons fit together mags; interchange plus military and civil. Just sayiing
Just In Case Jack says
Here’s our guide to air rifles.
Earl Hammer says
I read a bunch of these replies and I have an interesting gun to offer up. A few months ago I was looking for the ultimate bugout rifle. I wanted one in .223/5.56 that takes AR-15 mags, is light, and pack-able. I also wanted something that was reliable and at least pretty accurate… So what did I find??? Don’t laugh or roll your eyes, but I found a Keltec SU16c! I found it on the TNP (The Nothing Fancy Project) Youtube channel. They did three, yes three reviews on this gun and the final analysis was if somebody was breaching his property an SU16c might very well be used to confront that breach. The SU16c is piston driven and only weighs 4.7 lbs. unloaded. Watch this video.
The other guns I employ are a Walther 40 S&W, an Ar-15, Bolt action .243, and a Ruger 10/22. I have an AK and a lever action 22 Mag as back up. Yes, I know I need a shotgun, that is on the list next!
Darkman says
As far as which guns to own that is a personal choice. The most important thing to keep in mind is ammo and it’s availability. Stick with standard easy to come by calibers. 9mm,223/556,308 and all the 22 you can store. Remember these are all NATO rounds with the exception of the 22. When it comes to shotgun ammo I use 20 gauge in a Remington 870 both shot and slug. I only recommend the 20 gauge because it works well with a lighter recoil for my wife.
Dave says
Like every subject everyone is an expert. The best survival weapon is whatever YOU own and are most proficient with. Most of us own multiple guns so weight,ammo availability,and overall purpose has to be considered. Besides most of us probably won’t be bugging out alone so you also have to plan with YOUR teams who is carrying what firearm for what purpose.
MTguy says
I’m surprised the SKS didn’t make the list but the AK did. I’m my opinion the SKS is very robust like the AK (given you find the correct model), has identical if not better accuracy because it was designed as a semi auto, is cheaper and can regularly be found for around $350, shares the same cheap and easy to find 7.62, and it has the added benefit of not requiring bulky magazines so you can carry more ammo with you on stripper clips.
Cernunnos says
Overall a good post. I would point out as a gun store & range owner, I see as many AKs jamming as ARs – because most folks are using really cheap AKs. So if you choose an AK, spend the $$ to get a quality one.
And secondly – the largest artery is the aorta. It bifurcates in the ilium into the right and left external iliac arteries, and at the point where the circumflex femoral arteries branch off, becomes the femoral artery – the one that causes all the upper leg bleed-out potential. But it is NOT the largest artery in the body, that is the aorta in the thorax and abdominal cavity. Just saying.
ken says
keep in mine nato ammo, plenty of 9mm and 5.56
Michael says
Wouldn’t bother with a .22lr dedicated rifle. Who needs to carry the extra weight?. Instead, I’d carry a 9mm compact pistol, a 40 s&w pistol – I’d say .45 but the 40 ballistically gets much better penetration without the excess weight of the .45 acp round. I’d carry an ar-15 chambered in 5.56×45 NATO – insuring I could fire both 5.56 and .223 without pressure issues or otherwise. I’d carry a .22lr cmmg conversion bolt + mag. This way the rifle does double duty and I save the weight of carrying another dedicated rifle. The suppressor would also pull double duty between the 2 rounds. I’d carry an AR-10 chambered in .308 win. That way I could also shoot 7.62×51 NATO without chamber pressure or feed issues. Technically the suppressor for this rifle could pull triple duty w the AR-15 to save weight if needed. And I’d carry a Remington 870. Mossberg is nice but there’s less points of failure inside a Remington that’s been maintained. – pack half single ought buckshot and half pdx defender segmenting slugs – you can comfortably take large game up to and including moose/bear w those. With this setup, you’ve managed to suppress your main 3 rifles, you keep ammo compatibility, you don’t have to carry 3 individual cans nor a dedicated .22 rifle. And you don’t have to futs w an AK. Don’t get me wrong – ak’s are reliable – but a properly built and maintained AR does the job just as well w more accuracy. This also serves as a direct reminder to take care of your weapon instead of tossing it around. You pack less weight, you’re still able to throw down if needed, and all of your scenarios are covered with a backup 9mm compact if absolutely everything else goes to hell.
howie says
For survival I would look at the Henry.22 lever gun. Shoots 22,22l,22mag takes care of all rounds in that caliber in one gun. Knowing that you’re more than likely to trade for ammo and you wouldn’t have to be picky trading with .22 knowing you can shoot them all in one rifle. Just my 2 cents.
StevefromtheSouth says
Having served in our nation’s military and toted the AR type weapons “over here” and “over there” for decades I have developed a certain respect for the platform’s ability to “reach out and touch someone” up to several hundred yards without benefit of a scope. I don’t care for them as a hunting weapon and that is not the purpose for which they were designed. My primary use for this platform would be perimeter defense from 200-400 yards; my aging knees precluding any type of skirmishing or other offensive activity.
Having said that, it is rather curious that I don’t own an evil black rifle at this time. I have instead measured the distances around my humble abode and determined that no shots “in the open” will likely occur beyond 150 yards. In light of this, and in keeping with my overall goal of continuous marksmanship development, I have spent the last several years becoming a .22lr devotee.
I can’t remember the last time I missed an aimed shot with my 10/22, or with the Charger for that matter. Rapid fire drills are extremely rewarding as well, and having actually staged reactive targets at various locations and approach points for practice purposes, I am fairly confident that I can protect my home out to the distances at which it can be attacked in the clear. Small game hunting will also be a necessity and these tools are admirably suited to that job as well.
Some will mention longer distances, body armor, and snipers firing from the woods, and these are concerns which warrant a different approach, as does the need to procure somewhat larger game on occasion. Most of these needs are met with a well used .30-30, and extreme circumstances in these categories would fall in the realm of the Ruger American in .308 for a bit more distance.
So, primary attention goes to the 10/22 and 336, with the .308 just in case. The backup bag actually gets the Ruger Charger and a 14″ Contender in .30-30, personal EDC is an Officer’s model .45 (I see no valid reason to have excluded handguns from the discussion, other than argumentative sophistry on the part of the OP).
Giving such a weighty job to the .22 does mean that an extremely high level of proficiency is required, but the ability to attain and maintain such standards of marksmanship for a negligible cost in terms of equipment and ammunition was a huge consideration at the beginning of this journey. I reload for the others to decrease expense, but only the .22 has allowed me to practice often enough to truly become an expert in it’s use.
Many will disagree, and that is fine with me. My solutions fit my circumstances and are based on my experience. I won’t respond to or be dragged into discussions of what I’m doing wrong/caliber wars…after 15 years of armed service that included two years “in theater” I am content with my choices and rested in what I can comfortably prepare for. Too often these armchair discussions attempt to plan for every conceivable scenario, and rare is the person able to afford and deploy equipment sufficient to every need. Plan and prepare for that which is within your potential to overcome and the likelihood of its occurrence.
Just In Case Jack says
Well said, Steve.
Alan says
I guess i’ll toss my opinion into this , which means what I have already and plan to use lol.
Buckmark Camper 5 in barrel (22lr) – Quick , Deadly , Low Noise – anyone can shoot
Glock 19 – Universal ammo , PD , Military , Security everyone has them. Going to be a lot of battlefield trophies in a WROL or SHTF situation.
Kel-Tec SU16-CA – Fits .556/.223 ammo laying around as well as takes AR mags , lightweight , decent accuracy/distance
, folds.
Besides being what I have and train with these arms fit my survival plan , i’m not going to be in a battle with anyone if I can help it , this is about defense. I can defend my family with these because we are all trained with them. If you’re trained and only engage when you have to you can get any weapon you choose from the bad guys !
Knight 99 says
“There is only one choice ………….–the AK-47”
And the Ruger Mini 30, I like mine anyway. Hand-loaded with Hornady SP bullets it makes an adequate small to mid deer rifle along with plenty of predator protection.
laurie phillips says
im new to all this. would like to buy a rifle thats going to be a good one for bugging out,but not bankrupt me either. im also new to rifles,so any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. i have recurve bows and swords and knives,but thats about it for weapons. i really think in a bug out id need a rifle.
Just In Case Jack says
I recommend you read our Best Survival Rifles article for options and recommendations.
Also, check out our favorite Military Surplus Rifles article.
Joshua Burns says
I would say trash all of them and go with a M14 for distance a AKM for inside of 200M and a DDI – 12 for anything inside of 50 meters. However thats just me, I dont like giveing the other guy chances.
Edward richard says
Rem 700 is the largest gun recall of a firearm. Every single rem 700 is a untrustworthy firearm. Because of the trigger design it can fire with out pulling the trigger. Remington knew this when they released it. Don’t by Remeington they suck now more than ever and they can’t be trusted.
John says
At this moment, I don’t own a gun but looking to purchase one or several to get started. Better late than never. The information provided is excellent and has been a good starting point for me.
Trying to figure out whether to buy a scoped Ruger 10/22 or Scoped Ruger 10/22 Take-down as you described above. Was your selection based on the ability to disassemble the rifle easily?
I have signed up for a handgun course in May and looking to purchase one. Went to a local shop and really liked the feel of a Walthers PPQ M2. I haven’t read too many things about the gun. Do you have an opinion?
For hunting larger game, I having been looking at Winchesterr Model 70, Savage 11/111 Trophy, and Ruger American in .308. Worried about purchasing a Remington due to their bankruptcy filing..
And finally, everyone that I have spoken with, highly recommends an AR-15. There are a few places within driving distance that assembles/makes custom AR-15s and/of have a class for the person to build one.. They have alot of great reviews and are disabled veterans.. Is this a good route or would you recommend purchasing one from the manufacturers mentioned in your article.
I will not be buying all of these though I wish that I could. I welcome any opinions on the selections.
Thank you.
Don Russell says
you can’t CARRY the needed 30 lbs of other survival gear(that you’d BETTER always have if shtf) and more than one longarm (and enough ammo to keep 2 longarms in biz) So the best you can do is ONE longarm and maybe 2 lw, compact pistols, and very little ammo for the pistols. If it’s not an auto, not take down concealable, lacks a silencer and luminous sights, it’s not waf for survival. Forget shotguns, they are too limited. Forget single shots, muzzleloaders, bolt actions. Forget anything that lacks a box magazine, too. Get an M4 with a silencer and a Ciener .22lr conversion unit, a pocket 9mm and MAYBE as silenced .22lr handgun, like an 11 oz, 5.5″ long M21 Beretta Bobcat. If you know how, it can be very effectively silenced in just 3.5″ more length, 3 more ozs, group 2″ at 25 yds. It can have real sights and an extractor added, along with more slide weight, so that a LOT less noise comes out of the ejection port with the fired casing.
Don Russell says
you can’t shoot a gun that you aint got with you, and there will be no safe place to leave some guns while you go anywhere with another gun. you’d BETTER have NVD goggles, a silencer, luminous sights, soft armor, and subsonic ammo, and have enough sense to stay underground during daylight hours. if you do that, you’ll be 10x more likely to survive than anyone, with any gears or any number in their group, who violates that rule! Let the fire, starvation, in-fighting and diseases kill off 90-99%, as they WILL within a year of shtf. Then you’ll be many times safer as you scrounge whatever you need. There will be gear everywhere and nobody to stop you from occupying a primo spot. Use sprouting and root veggies for the later times, but you’d BETTER have a 6 month supply of food cached. That’s not that expensive at all. About $1 per day per person, if you buy locally grown grain and legumes, from the farmers, at harvest season. A bushel is 55 lbs, of which 10% is dust. That bushel will average $10, so 20c a lb and you’ll need to eat about 5 lbs per day. if you are a big man. and that’s all you have. Best stash some honey, salt, and peanut butter. Such stuff is about $1 a lb in bulk containers. and you only need about 1/2 lb per day of each, then 3 lbs of the grain-legumes. So a 6 month supply is going to run you a bit about $600, per person, for 6 months and the plastic buckets, ratwire, mylar, vacumn packer, drumliners will take you up around $800. That’s not much and you can always eat the food, ya know.
STEVE ERICKSON says
Retired Navy, Vietnam vet so I have several guns now, 10-22 take-down is great, Built a 300 blackout take-down pistol last year for 125 grain bullet for a point blank range of 300 yard for a 10 inch circle. Got rid of my AR-10 when i moved to Colorado i did not see a need for a 1000 yard shot. have 45, 40, and 9 mm pistols to work with now. The marines tell me they are qualifying at 500 yards with the AR-16 but i did not like the 556 ammo so wanted a heaver 30 cal bullet.
Bob Staurovsky says
I was reading comments that people let here, most are very good if staying in place, but there may come that time when bugout is the only option. My wife and I decided to get Alice Packs to carry, now the weight factor comes into play. What do you take and what do you leave behind was our big question, then we needed to find the answers. Well when it came to Firearms, I had to rely on my hunting skills. I saw a lot of people said AK-47, AR-15, 30-06 and many others, but for weight, the good ole .22 caliber is our choice. First the Henry AR-7 is 4 pounds, it comes apart, pieces fit right into its own stock and floats, about 16″ long when stored, the ammo is light for the amount of rounds you can carry and for the most part you can get quite a bit of smaller game with it. Second was a handgun, we choose the 4″ barrel Charter Arms .22 caliber revolver, they don’t jamb as would an automatic that got dirty. As for the ammo, we took 3 small peanut butter containers, fill each with 350 rounds each, my wife carries 1 and I carry 2, being a weight factor. Also we each have Remington Nylon 66’s to carry, about 4 1/2 pounds, they are a .22 caliber rifle, and can take a beating in mud, snow and rain and keep on working. Just remember weight is always a factor when bugging out, Happy Prepping to All !!!
Sean says
I live in CA and I sense the ar15/ak47 are NOT options due to the restrictions the state has placed on them as assault weapons (I.e. the ‘brown button’). So what option is best?
Wally1 says
Ok, I will bite, This is a interesting conversation. It also depends where you live. In the NE or SE, you have a very diminished chance of survival, Why? Just way too many people. How long do you think deer and other types of food source will last in a total societal meltdown?. Also you have to live near a fresh, clean water source, usually meaning a northern area. As to weapons, It is really hard to beat a Ruger 10/22 with suppressor for hunting small game and deer. Next a long rang rifle for protection. Popular, easy to obtain is .308, 30-06, 300 win mag. close range defensive, AR15 and a reliable 9mm, Glock etc. Maybe even a good compound bow and arrow. The main problem for survival is to stay away from people, more people die from disease in any conflict. Best is a coastal area, fishing is always available, more so than land animals. The struggle will to stay alive for 6 months to a year until the urban areas fail and fall into decay.
axelsteve says
well as for me,I do not subscribe to the Poodle shooter and hand held poodle shooter (9mm) as your load out cause it is too limiting. However as for me. A Marlin 60 cause I had one and liked it. The 10/22 cause I had one. A marlin 70 for the same reason.I also had a folding stock for the 10/22. A mosin 38 would be handy I would put a Boyds stock on it to make living with it easier.I also like the sks for when things get funky. I also would like a good 1911 with some decent sights on it.I also like the 870 and m 37 Ithica I like the Idea of the shells get chucked straight to the ground. I also give the m ! carbine honorable mention.
Jim says
Most of this article is decent . First I do agree with owning a .22 LR for small game and the ammo as mentioned. The only persoal experiences with the Ruger 10/22 rifles in standard configuration were not great and have owned four of them. If the standard ones are not great then how accurate are the take down models going to be after being dissembled ? To take head shots on a squirrel you are aiming for a target about the size of a quarter. I base this on a lifetime of hunting them and killing thousands. The Remington 700 is a fine rifle if it is glass bedded and hand loaded for, but how may rifles are you going to need and be able to carry at one time. Most times if a person is 400 to 500 yards away I will try to sneak away quietly and move on ! The author talks about only cleaning his AK every six times out. Has no one ever told him of corrosive primers and what they do to metal left uncleaned for several days ? No might not fail for several times but are you willing to risk your life hoping against that one time. A Ar-15 is a great choice for a survival rifle since it is light ammo is available and light weight unless you plan on fighting the battle of the bulge. A 308 is more powerful and can pack a bigger whollop at long range. However it is much heaver, ammo more expensive and weighs twice as much. If A person has to move quickly over a long distance then every pound less he has to hump will make a Hugh difference.
The most ideal situation would be to have four people who were close friends in a group or family, where one has a .22 rifle, one a Ar-15, one a rifle capable of long distance shots maybe even a scoped .5.56 and one a shotgun. For grown men in good shape a extra AR-15 lashed to a back pack could also be a nice option. Just remember there in bug out situations there are no such things as permanent sites or situations unless you want to end up like Gen George Armstrong Custer. Many of the LRP guys in Viet Nam carried more than one weapon but both were not M1 Garrands
KGB says
Great conversation. Some professionals have spoken as well as some internet commandos. My suggestions are simple. Ownership does not, will not ever equal proficiency. Commitments of time and finances are essential. Other than a .22LR, I stay with NATO calibers. My rifle is a heavy,proven, Bushmaster with a 16 year old AIMPOINT and a GEMTEC suppressor. I have four GLOCK and a suitcase of mags. All are 9mm. Keep it stupid simple. Remington 870 Mariner and two suppressed Ruger .22s round it out. The real force multiplier is NVG or Thermal Optics. 2 is 1. is none.
Phillip bass says
Both me and my wife will be bugging in. Have one year food and water and seeds for garden. Have 3 of each: ak47, 22, 12 gauge, .243, 30-30, 9mm handgun and .38 special and .40 cal. Have 3000 rounds for each gun and still buying. If I don’t have it covered then I give up
Ranger A says
I constantly see people write that you can carry 1,000 rounds of .22LR around in your pockets. You could, but it wouldn’t be much fun. 1,000 rounds of 22LR weighs a little over 7 pounds. Thats a lot of weight to be lugging around in your pockets. That’s about the equivalent weight of two loaded M1911, .45’s and two spare magazines. A small backpack would be a much better alternative.
Crow says
Best survival/ SHTF defense weapons you ask?
Absolutly ANYTHING and EVERYTHING you can get your hands on between now and that day, that is totally friggin IILEGAL to own, Possess, or operate without a license. Find it, hide It, Bury it, and keep your mouth shut about it until the day you absolutely Need it.
Ralph Law says
Just in Case Jack,
Truly enjoyed your no-nonsense, and get to the point article. Hey, many of us have fences because we own animals. Your link to the nuclear bunkers is a nice bonus.
An old Marine here enjoying your Mini-14 pick. All women need to learn to be comfortable with a shotgun.
Too much pressure otherwise. Thanks again!
Steve says
In the matter of survival:
22 semi – have 2
9mm Carbine with 9mm side arm
Pump shotgun preferably 7+1
Ar-15
.308 either a bolt action or in an AR-10 ( have both)
Rather then getting more variety, I go for multiple units or invest in upgraded optics. Close in I use a red dot with Flip up Magnifier, moving to a 3x9x40 and moving out to 4x16x44–go for quality glass. JMHO
Just one guys survival arsenal.
Rev. Ray says
After 45 years of making my living in the Army, with a border enforcement agency and as a small arms instructor to 12 foreign military organizations, I have used several types of weapons for serious social encounters under many conditions.
Each of the major military arms currently in use has good and not-so-good characterisitcs. For survival, you need reasonable power, usable accuracy, extreme reliability, and ammuntion availability. Selective fire capability is next to worthless, as is huge ammo capacity and battery operated toys hanging on the weapon.
Survivng means AVOIDING conflict unless forced into it. If you must fight, do so to break contact and escape, avoiding the ‘Red Dawn’ concept of untrained civilians confronting (and defeating) real military units.
My choice, for several decades, has been a quality lever action carbine in a common caliber. And, yes, I have actually used them in serious confrontations.
Sepfian says
Make sense, Sir. Thought that too.
Think that M1 are superior that AR 15.
Battle proven when fight with Nazi’s Army.
Unknown Soldier says
You will never see an AK-47 the last one was made in 1961, on my Dad’s birthday.
This just gives fuel to the anti gun libtards. Call them what they are, knock offs.
The AKM, was the first, then the AKS came and flooded the US market.
Any AK variant can not be converted to select fire after 1994. So any lineage you think you might have had is broken. They are also inferior to many others and the 7.62×39 is obsolete and is not being made but for the US market.
Stay ion target……
Who the heck is carrying around 5 long guns. I carried a M60 machine , and that about all this 17 year old could handle.
Let say some one(Eugene Stoner) invented a platform that will take many calibers with NO modification.
You need ONE lower and several uppers.
5.56 IS 22 caliber just like rimfire. You can get or make 5.56 using rimfire projectiles. The only reason we have a 1979 Marlin Model 60, you know the assault gun rimfire thingy that carries 18 killer rimfire cartridges.
Also have 2 large ammo cans full of rimfire. One is just CCI stingers. Ity took 5 years to fill it.
You do not need a 22 rimfire, maybe a air rifle if you want to be really quiet, or put a can on either.
Next a longer reaching cartridge, I think 6.8 Grendel would suit the ticket well. Need some special parts, its still one lower.
fire suppression. Well the 300 blackout OR 300 HAMR were made for this. The blackout you can use a can for subsonic, or 30-30 style ballistics from the 300 HAMR. (it out shines the 7.62×39).
Inside of 200 yards is where the 300 blackout shines. Point blank, if you want a second firearm, sure get a shotgun. I hatem. I use a marlin 1895 guide gun, all the way out to 100 yards, nothing survives.
We have shot hogs to elk with these firearms.
My friend shoots buffalo with his great granddad’s 30-30. The 300 HAMR will do the job easy.
I took a 870 Remy deer Master overseas, and it worked all the time. Cutting trail or night defense.
The Mossy 500s seem to rattle when get worn. The Mossy pump release is in the right place.
So now instead of 5 rifles, you have one rifle platform that does a heck of a lot. Thank you Eugene.
(and a shot gun if you can handle one)
balisong says
no, no, no. You can’t be making noise, you need to be able to hit at night. it needs to pierce soft armor , be usable with just one hand/arm, use the GI rd, use the .22lr, be available without anyone knowing you have it, It needs to offer rapidfire, snipe effectively to 1/4 mile, Stop men to 100m with a single torso hit and mess them up badly to 200m with such a hit. Beyond such ranges, it wont matter if they flop around a bit before they bleed out and die. You have to carry 30lbs of other stuff, all the time. Food, water, night vision, shelter/sleep gear, pistol, etc. So you can’t carry more than one longarm (and enough ammo to make two of them worth carrying). You can’t shoot a gun you aint got with you. you can’t get men or animals to WAIT while you go GET “the right gun for the job”. A gun for which you have no ammo is just a club.
So, for all those reasons, you want a shorty AR-15, in 223, with a $160, 3/4 lb CMMG .22lr conversion unit, 223 silencer, scoped option, night sights, trigger job, see thru mount for the scope, hard belt case for the scope, subsonic ammo for the .22lr, so you dont call in enemies for a mile around when you pop a rabbit, You need to be able to brain deer, hogs, men, dogs at 50m, and be BB gun quiet as you do so. The 60 gr 223 softpoint will stop men with a single torso hit, and take deer to 150m with chest hits. with an anti-cant bubble level, trigger job, 69 gr hpbt match ammo, free float tube and mount for the GI bipod, it will snipe effectively to 1/4 mile. You need night vision and enough brains to stay underground during daytime. the animals will all be gone within 2 months of shtf, and within a year, 99% of the population will be dead, so what will you fire lots of ammo AT?, hmm. The findable calibers will be 9mm, 223 and .22lr. If shtf, the N guard and miilitary arsenals will be breeched, and that means that such calibers will be what you find beside dead bodies. there’s more .22lr ammo and imported here than all other calibers combined, to include shotshells. 60 gr Aquila subsonic 22 ammo cycles reliably, making that 30 rd box mag and silencer a deadly combo at night. Such ammo is 100 rds to the lb, while 12 ga shells are 10 to the lb. Your blasts will call in every enemy within a mile and with a bolt action, single shot, or shotgun, you wont be able to fight. (worth a hoot) People will be desperate, ruthless and well armed. Many will be armored, some will have night vision, too.
balisong says
EVERY man on this site is CERTAIN that he can hit the 12×24″ man’s torso at 400m, so WHY can’t you hit the 6″ brain circle of a big animal at 100m, eh?k Every many here is CERTAIN that he can get within 40m of big animals an arrow them. So WHY can’t you get within 100m and brain them with a rifle, hmm? you can’t BRACE the bow, while you CAN brace the rifle, on a walking stick, on your frame pack, on a tree or boulder. You should not BE in open country during daylight hours, and you should not be making noise. it only take ONE man to kill you and there can (and WILL) be MANY that you can’t see, in all directions within the sound of your shot. If you know to hold shut the 22 bolt with your off hand, the subonic Ammo, 22 unit and 223 silencer can make that combo BB gun quiet. THAT is what you want, with night vision, AVOID people and if you’re going to shoot a critter, shoot a COW or horse,at night, in the head, from 10m, with the .22, move the meat a mile from the gutpile, hide head and hooves, convert it into jerky and get it into your pre-buried 35 gallon drums. A bit of meth is all you’ll need to watch your back trail all day for several days and to run the smoke-teepees of brush all night. During the day, get the meat under your bugnets, and out in the sun.
balisong says
EVERY man on this site is CERTAIN that he can hit the 12×24″ man’s torso at 400m, so WHY can’t you hit the 6″ brain circle of a big animal at 100m, eh?k Every many here is CERTAIN that he can get within 40m of big animals an arrow them. So WHY can’t you get within 100m and brain them with a rifle, hmm? you can’t BRACE the bow, while you CAN brace the rifle, on a walking stick, on your frame pack, on a tree or boulder. You should not BE in open country during daylight hours, and you should not be making noise. it only take ONE man to kill you and there can (and WILL) be MANY that you can’t see, in all directions within the sound of your shot. If you know to hold shut the 22 bolt with your off hand, the subonic Ammo, 22 unit and 223 silencer can make that combo BB gun quiet. THAT is what you want, with night vision, AVOID people and if you’re going to shoot a critter, shoot a COW or horse,at night, in the head, from 10m, with the .22, move the meat a mile from the gutpile, hide head and hooves, convert it into jerky and get it into your pre-buried 35 gallon drums. A bit of meth is all you’ll need to watch your back trail all day for several days and to run the smoke-teepees of brush all night. During the day, get the meat under your bugnets, and out in the sun.
A month after shtf, most dead bodies will be found with .22lr, 223 ammo. since everything else is so inferior, heavy, bulky. there’s LOT more cattle and horses than elk, moose or bears. :_) There’s a lot more hogs, sheep and goats than deer, and a lot more chickens and tame, fenced ducks and turkeys than wild small game. There will be no way to know if the “farme” you meet is the legit owner of the animals, or just the farmer’s (recent) killer. Many farmers are going to flee their farms, or die of disease, etc. Dogs, cats and people are going to kill everything. Dont kill your kids by hunting/starving when they could be eating beef jerky and grain, while all of you hidden in a tunnel.
Sites like these are just a sales job for the ammo and gun companies. or guys who want to dump such guns after they have wised up by reading stuff i’ve posted about this. Spend your money on night vision and armor, not a dozen guns and 10’s of thousands of rds. 99% of the population is going to be DEAD a year after shtf. The animals and fish are going to be gone within 2 months of shtf. cannibalism will then be commonplace. So what will you be shooting lots of ammo AT, hmm? who will barter much for it, when there’s so little use for it? I stockpile in case of shortages, and I use Airsoft and .177 pellet guns for a lot of my training. So I dont need to fire so many .22’s. a few thousand rds per year thru the AR’s conversion unit. I just shoot my cast bullet reloads thru the 9mm. Your pistol should be a micro 9mm single stack, in a front pants pocket holster, for shtf. Once the longarms come out, the pistol wont amount to a hoot.
Richard Bruce says
What about the Savage 24V? It was good enough to be onboard every B-52 bomber for years! Mine is 30-30 over 20GA.
Tabitha says
So, why is a shotgun listed here on a top 5 RIFLE article? You specifically mentioned how a pistol is not a choice in the article because it’s not a rifle, but then you use a shotgun…
I also disagree with using an AK for pretty much anything but spray and pray while beating the shit out of your shoulder with recoil. I would rather have a lever action .357 over an AK.
Mark Dreyer says
I note there is a great deal of speculation about the SHTF course of events in the USA. It occurs to me to wonder if any of you have talked to people who have already been through it, the Apocalypse Now? There are a few…
I am a South African. I never really planned for the ‘End of Times’ scenario, However it seems to me that over the years I acquired & have in stock what I’ll need whatever (more) befalls anyway.
Herewith my list:
1, For heavy game, not the heaviest, but they are not so common anyway, a Sako Finnbear in .375 H&H Magnum with a detachable Nikko Sterling ‘scope, not high magnification, for light gathering. I’d rather have got a Sako Safari, but didn’t find one. I know mine is good for eland, kudu & blou wildebees (brindled gnu).
2. For medium game, the SMLE Mk III. It is accurate, sturdy, with a good clean killing calibre (.303 natch). This rifle is first fruit of the British Army’s horrible experience of Boer marksmanship. It is a battle-rifle; it gave the Kaiser’s army its death rattle, & stood the test in battle for another half century & more, but even so as near as damnit to Jeff Cooper’s ‘scout rifle’ as they come, which is why it came with a superlong bayonet, to match reach with the enemy ( I have one too). Its good for any medium game on this continent & won’t spoil meat. Its also good for snakes in the grass out to 300 yards, & the rate of fire is AMPLE.
3. For the small stuff, like spring-hares I have a kettie – what you call a slingshot. & it won’t attract bipedal attention. ‘Nuff said
4. But for plinking I have an Anschutz air rifle in.177. Training & practice is not to be scorned, & the skills are tranferrable. I’d rather have got a Crossman Vanguard in .22, but there wasn’t one.
5. For home & hearth protection out to 300 m I have a Ruger Mini-14 tactical (folding stock) I don’t like that, but that’s what there was to be had. It’s good with military issue 5,56 ammo out to 300m & can make a clover-leaf at 350m. Mind you, as accuracy goes, there is a world of difference between double tap deliberate fire into an identified target; & spray & pray, which I do not do. Don’t hunt with it – it makes a mess of meat.
6. More for home & hearth protection, in & around the house, there is a Mossberg-500 tactical – again – damnit! In musketry, one steers with the stock. People who actually use guns know this. But again that’s what I got. It’s good for fowl & what-have-you also, but I am looking for a slug barrel to go with. I may find it.
7. My S&W Highway Patrolman, with a 4″ barrel, not too much gun & easy carry. & I am seldom without it, out in the Bush, or downtown Pretoria. As we know, it’s reliable, powerful, in .357m, & .38sp is good for practice, & work, at a pinch.
8. A Rossi revolver in .32S&W long, carry for my wife.
My grandmother had a Webley Ulster Constabulary revolver in .455, taken off a British Bridge Guard officer by her father in the Karoo in 1901. She carried it in her handbag. Relisenceing it one day, she showed the Constable, & he goggled at her. He said, “Auntie, you can just hit the felon with this handbag, & he’ll die anyway!”
I go along with the people who say the best gun for you is the one you’re carrying… Now…
Apologies to those of dainty sensibilities, but down our way, in our sandy world, we have no happy memories of the AR-15 family. & speaking for myself, a self-loading rifle that has a chambering assist tells you everything you want to know about the gun.
I worked & I fought with the R-1 battle rifle, the Belgian FN Fal, the Right Arm of the Free World, & also with the R-4 assault rifle, the Israeli Galil, a tried & true work-horse of the AK-47 stable – hard to beat. When TSHTF, it may be I’ll get my hands on one of them again. Just because I have what I have now doesn’t mean it’ll stay that way.
8. A
loy hoyle says
Great article ! Lots of goid comments…i choose a .38 model 10 , and a mini 14. reliable , easy to disassemble/clean..as accurate as the person shooting.. I own a rem 870 , but i’m old and have shoulder/back issues. forget long range – eyes are shot.
Bighound says
Springfield Squad Scout, 18′ inch barrel, fires 7.62 NATO or .308 kicks some serious ass. Go fire it, put it through a few paces and you will want it for most SHTF situations